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jinydu Member of the 'S.O.S. Math' Hall of Fame
Joined: 07 Nov 2004 Posts: 2988
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Posted: Mon, 28 Nov 2005 03:20:34 UTC Post subject: Question about Bessel Functions |
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Here's a question that came up while I was working on an interesting problem that I made up for myself. How can I prove that, given the differential equation:
, where is a constant
with the initial condition
the only solution is the trivial solution:
For bonus points, show that with the differential equation
, where n is a nonzero integer
we must have (assuming that the function is defined at that point) |
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mathisfun Member of the 'S.O.S. Math' Hall of Fame
Joined: 26 Nov 2004 Posts: 761
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Posted: Mon, 28 Nov 2005 22:07:41 UTC Post subject: |
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Hint for the first problem:
Let .
Assuming that the condition for the first problem ( ) also applies to problem two, you can employ the above approach to dispatch the second problem as well. |
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jinydu Member of the 'S.O.S. Math' Hall of Fame
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Posted: Thu, 1 Dec 2005 00:29:15 UTC Post subject: Re: Question about Bessel Functions |
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| mathisfun wrote: | Hint for the first problem:
Let .
Assuming that the condition for the first problem ( ) also applies to problem two, you can employ the above approach to dispatch the second problem as well. |
So
Using that substitution (and assuming in the process that k is nonzero):
But now what...? This doesn't seem any simpler than the original differential equation (all we've done is changed one of the coefficients)... |
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mathisfun Member of the 'S.O.S. Math' Hall of Fame
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Posted: Fri, 2 Dec 2005 03:48:56 UTC Post subject: |
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I apologize for the error. I meant to say: Let . Such a substitution should reduce the given equation to a Bessel equation of order zero.
Mr. Fantastic, please feel free to castigate me most severely. |
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jinydu Member of the 'S.O.S. Math' Hall of Fame
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Posted: Fri, 2 Dec 2005 06:20:43 UTC Post subject: |
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| mathisfun wrote: | I apologize for the error. I meant to say: Let . Such a substitution should reduce the given equation to a Bessel equation of order zero.
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I see. But is there a simple way that I could answer the question I posed at the beginning (other than quoting results whose proof I haven't seen)? |
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mathisfun Member of the 'S.O.S. Math' Hall of Fame
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Posted: Sat, 3 Dec 2005 03:16:55 UTC Post subject: |
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Because must remain bounded as r -> 0, we must discard because it has a logarithmic singularity at r = 0. Thus, we obtain:
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jinydu Member of the 'S.O.S. Math' Hall of Fame
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Posted: Sat, 3 Dec 2005 06:38:03 UTC Post subject: |
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Thank you mathisfun
So essentially, the question reduces down:
Show that is finite and nonzero.
(Can you see? I'm trying to rediscover properties of the Bessel function myself...) |
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mathisfun Member of the 'S.O.S. Math' Hall of Fame
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Posted: Sat, 3 Dec 2005 14:35:00 UTC Post subject: |
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Correct. You can show that by solving Bessel's differential equation of order 0 in a neighborhood about the regular singular point r = 0 and using the definition of . |
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jinydu Member of the 'S.O.S. Math' Hall of Fame
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Posted: Sun, 4 Dec 2005 08:03:51 UTC Post subject: |
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| mathisfun wrote: | Correct. You can show that by solving Bessel's differential equation of order 0 in a neighborhood about the regular singular point r = 0 and using the definition of . |
I see... So how do I solve the differential equation in a neighborhood (presumably that means "near") about r = 0? |
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mathisfun Member of the 'S.O.S. Math' Hall of Fame
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Posted: Sun, 4 Dec 2005 18:07:34 UTC Post subject: |
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| Ordinary series methods will fail because the coefficients of y' and y are not analytic at x = 0; hence, x=0 is not a regular point. To solve the equation about x = 0, use the Frobenius method. If you are not familiar with this technique, refer to the section on ODEs near a regular singular point in your differential equations textbook. |
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jinydu Member of the 'S.O.S. Math' Hall of Fame
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Posted: Mon, 5 Dec 2005 02:15:21 UTC Post subject: |
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| mathisfun wrote: | | Ordinary series methods will fail because the coefficients of y' and y are not analytic at x = 0; hence, x=0 is not a regular point. To solve the equation about x = 0, use the Frobenius method. If you are not familiar with this technique, refer to the section on ODEs near a regular singular point in your differential equations textbook. |
Actually, when I plug r = 0 into the differential equation, it appears that any function satisfies the differential equation at that point, provided that the function and its first two derivatives are finite at r = 0...
I don't have a differential equations textbook, just a standard calculus textbook. Its not too surprising that my textbook doesn't cover this problem, since I made up this problem myself (as part of a larger problem)... |
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Pwrong Math Cadet
Joined: 02 Dec 2005 Posts: 6 Location: Perth, Australia
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Posted: Mon, 5 Dec 2005 16:05:38 UTC Post subject: |
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Have a look at equation 41 on http://mathworld.wolfram.com/BesselFunctionoftheFirstKind.html
If m=0 and x=0, then every term in series is zero except the first. . If x=0 but m is nonzero, then every term in the series is zero, so
| Quote: | | I don't have a differential equations textbook, just a standard calculus textbook. Its not too surprising that my textbook doesn't cover this problem, since I made up this problem myself (as part of a larger problem)... |
My calc textbook has the bessel equation in it, although it's only one question, and we never covered the frobenius method in lectures. |
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