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Question about Bessel Functions

 
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jinydu
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PostPosted: Mon, 28 Nov 2005 03:20:34 UTC    Post subject: Question about Bessel Functions Reply with quote

Here's a question that came up while I was working on an interesting problem that I made up for myself. How can I prove that, given the differential equation:

, where is a constant

with the initial condition



the only solution is the trivial solution:



For bonus points, show that with the differential equation

, where n is a nonzero integer

we must have (assuming that the function is defined at that point)
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mathisfun
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PostPosted: Mon, 28 Nov 2005 22:07:41 UTC    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hint for the first problem:

Let .

Assuming that the condition for the first problem () also applies to problem two, you can employ the above approach to dispatch the second problem as well.
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jinydu
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PostPosted: Thu, 1 Dec 2005 00:29:15 UTC    Post subject: Re: Question about Bessel Functions Reply with quote

mathisfun wrote:
Hint for the first problem:

Let .

Assuming that the condition for the first problem () also applies to problem two, you can employ the above approach to dispatch the second problem as well.


So











Using that substitution (and assuming in the process that k is nonzero):





But now what...? This doesn't seem any simpler than the original differential equation (all we've done is changed one of the coefficients)...
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mathisfun
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PostPosted: Fri, 2 Dec 2005 03:48:56 UTC    Post subject: Reply with quote

I apologize for the error. I meant to say: Let . Such a substitution should reduce the given equation to a Bessel equation of order zero.





Mr. Fantastic, please feel free to castigate me most severely.
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jinydu
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PostPosted: Fri, 2 Dec 2005 06:20:43 UTC    Post subject: Reply with quote

mathisfun wrote:
I apologize for the error. I meant to say: Let . Such a substitution should reduce the given equation to a Bessel equation of order zero.


I see. But is there a simple way that I could answer the question I posed at the beginning (other than quoting results whose proof I haven't seen)?
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mathisfun
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PostPosted: Sat, 3 Dec 2005 03:16:55 UTC    Post subject: Reply with quote



Because must remain bounded as r -> 0, we must discard because it has a logarithmic singularity at r = 0. Thus, we obtain:

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jinydu
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PostPosted: Sat, 3 Dec 2005 06:38:03 UTC    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thank you mathisfun

So essentially, the question reduces down:

Show that is finite and nonzero.

(Can you see? I'm trying to rediscover properties of the Bessel function myself...)
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mathisfun
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PostPosted: Sat, 3 Dec 2005 14:35:00 UTC    Post subject: Reply with quote

Correct. You can show that by solving Bessel's differential equation of order 0 in a neighborhood about the regular singular point r = 0 and using the definition of .
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jinydu
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PostPosted: Sun, 4 Dec 2005 08:03:51 UTC    Post subject: Reply with quote

mathisfun wrote:
Correct. You can show that by solving Bessel's differential equation of order 0 in a neighborhood about the regular singular point r = 0 and using the definition of .


I see... So how do I solve the differential equation in a neighborhood (presumably that means "near") about r = 0?
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mathisfun
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PostPosted: Sun, 4 Dec 2005 18:07:34 UTC    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ordinary series methods will fail because the coefficients of y' and y are not analytic at x = 0; hence, x=0 is not a regular point. To solve the equation about x = 0, use the Frobenius method. If you are not familiar with this technique, refer to the section on ODEs near a regular singular point in your differential equations textbook.
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jinydu
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PostPosted: Mon, 5 Dec 2005 02:15:21 UTC    Post subject: Reply with quote

mathisfun wrote:
Ordinary series methods will fail because the coefficients of y' and y are not analytic at x = 0; hence, x=0 is not a regular point. To solve the equation about x = 0, use the Frobenius method. If you are not familiar with this technique, refer to the section on ODEs near a regular singular point in your differential equations textbook.


Actually, when I plug r = 0 into the differential equation, it appears that any function satisfies the differential equation at that point, provided that the function and its first two derivatives are finite at r = 0...

I don't have a differential equations textbook, just a standard calculus textbook. Its not too surprising that my textbook doesn't cover this problem, since I made up this problem myself (as part of a larger problem)...
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Pwrong
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PostPosted: Mon, 5 Dec 2005 16:05:38 UTC    Post subject: Reply with quote

Have a look at equation 41 on http://mathworld.wolfram.com/BesselFunctionoftheFirstKind.html
If m=0 and x=0, then every term in series is zero except the first. . If x=0 but m is nonzero, then every term in the series is zero, so

Quote:
I don't have a differential equations textbook, just a standard calculus textbook. Its not too surprising that my textbook doesn't cover this problem, since I made up this problem myself (as part of a larger problem)...


My calc textbook has the bessel equation in it, although it's only one question, and we never covered the frobenius method in lectures.
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